Sisters-in-Service

From Navy Veteran to Author: Beth H Macy's Journey of Resilience and Reinvention

• Beth H. Macy • Episode 155

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What drives someone to join the military during a time of national dissent? In our latest episode, we sit down with Beth H Macy, a Navy veteran and multifaceted talent, to uncover her unique journey into military service shortly after the Vietnam War. Beth opens up about her initial goal to join the military.

Beth provides an unvarnished look at the challenges female veterans face, particularly single parents navigating male-dominated fields. From battling stereotypes to proving their competence, the hurdles are numerous. Beth’s personal anecdotes highlight the struggle of transitioning from military to civilian life in the late 70s and early 80s, touching on the difficulties of accessing VA benefits and adjusting to a new environment. Her story underscores the themes of resilience and adaptation that are so crucial for veterans making this often daunting transition.

The conversation takes a turn into the realm of identity and recognition, particularly for female veterans whose service is often overlooked. Beth shares her emotional journey of feeling validated and recognized through small yet profound moments. She also dives into her successful transition from a high-tech career to becoming an author of Russian spy novels, inspired by the pandemic lockdown. With future projects on the horizon, including a potential movie adaptation and a solo art show, Beth’s story is a testament to embracing fear, taking risks, and the endless possibilities that lie ahead for those brave enough to push boundaries. Tune in to be inspired by Beth's courage and resilience, and learn how you too can seize the opportunities life presents.

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Speaker 1:

Welcome to Sisters in Service podcast. Most of you know me as a strong advocate for women veterans in being recognized not only as veterans but also as women who are changing the world through our passion of serving even after service. This podcast is my passion by telling all the stories of military brats, military spouses, active duty and veterans, not to forget the veteran service organizations that help us along our transition journey. I want to thank you in advance for listening. I hope that you will join me. Every week, a new podcast and episode comes out every Tuesday, so I hope that you will join and I hope that you enjoy. This podcast is brought to you by Small Space Pilates. Are you ready to get fit and fabulous from the comfort of your own home? Look no further than Small Space Pilates. With live online Pilates and strength training classes, a video library and a no perfection allowed policy, you can achieve your fitness goals without ever leaving your house. Click on the link for your complimentary week and start your journey to feeling fabulous today. Welcome everyone to our latest episode of Sisters in Service.

Speaker 1:

You know me, I'm Kat Corchado, and I'm super excited today because I have as my guest Beth H Macy. I know you don't know her, but you will. She is a multifaceted talent who is also an author of the Moscow Night series, but she is also a military veteran Navy, and she served right after the Vietnam War, which is what intrigued me a lot. Okay, however, that's not all she does. She has supported many as a licensed mental health counselor. She's also been a personal trainer. She's an author. She does all the things. Beth, welcome to Sisters in Service.

Speaker 2:

Oh, thank you, Kat, it's wonderful to be here.

Speaker 1:

Well, I was super intrigued by the fact that I don't get to talk to a lot of veterans, specifically women, who served, like, either during the Vietnam War, which I'm super interested in, and quite and a little bit after which is when you actually went into the military. So, beth, here's my question that I ask all veterans Did you pick the Navy or did the Navy pick you?

Speaker 2:

Well, actually the Navy was my second choice. My father was an airline pilot, so I actually wanted to go into the Air Force, but at that time the quotas were full and the Navy still had room. So I guess in a way we we picked each other and so I went into the Navy. I like the uniform, so why not?

Speaker 1:

I almost went into the Navy. I tell people this all the time I love the Navy dress. Whites, yes, aren't they beautiful? Yeah. And the recruiter, he says to me, you know, they hardly ever wear those. And I said, well, what's their regular uniform? And he showed me. I was like, oh no, that's not going to work for me, because I grew up in the 70s with like bell bottoms and everything. I'm like, no, no, we're not doing that again. So my father was Air Force, which is I was born into the military.

Speaker 2:

And so I said well, let me just go in the Air Force, because that's what I know best, you know. So I learned after I went into the Navy that my grandfather had served in the Navy.

Speaker 1:

So, wow, we'll see there, it's in your blood. It's in your blood, beth. What was it about serving in the military that just made you say I want to do this? And the reason I'm asking is that during that time a lot of people had a bad taste in their mouth about the Vietnam War, and I remember because my dad had to go to Vietnam and I remember vividly watching on TV as Vietnam veterans who were actually, as they're coming home, people were spitting on them, which would make anybody not want to go in the military. What was your why for going in at that point in time?

Speaker 2:

See, well, I grew up without much money in a seaside city, new Bedford, but I didn't see many opportunities. I had trained as a math teacher in college but I didn't want to teach math. So I had friends who were going cross-country and backpacking around or going to Australia to be teachers and I wanted to do something responsible and I'm very patriotic, so I thought I'll go into the service. You know and you know, join the Navy, see the world. It's not just a job, it's an adventure, right?

Speaker 1:

It's an adventure. I remember that. Remember that. Yeah, I do yeah.

Speaker 2:

We're flying in, sinker there. I went right that, yeah, I do. Yeah, we're blind and sinker there. I went right. Oh so, and and yes, my friends were were pretty amazed because I had protested against the vietnam war, um, you know, trying to to help bring our guys home, because I had, I had friends who had been sent over there. And one of my friends came back pretty damaged emotionally and mentally and years later actually committed suicide. So, it really was very traumatic for a lot of those veterans.

Speaker 1:

I bet, Did you say you grew up in New Bedford Mass? Yes, I did. Yes, my husband grew up and we lived in Dartmouth Massachusetts. I lived in Dartmouth too after New Bedford that we went to.

Speaker 2:

Dartmouth yeah, I went to Dartmouth.

Speaker 1:

He was actually born in New Bedford. I believe I was too Small world right Small world, very small world.

Speaker 2:

Right small world, very small world.

Speaker 1:

That's amazing, yeah so when you went in Beth, were you, what were your expectations, and did the Navy meet those expectations?

Speaker 2:

oh well, you know, have you ever seen? There's a Goldie Hawn movie where she she goes into I think it's the army and she looks and she goes where's the condos? Right, yeah, you know, her expectations were so far off. Well, I I did expect that I would get trained in something useful and that I'd come out with whatever skills there were and be able to to use them on the outside. And be able to use them on the outside and the first part of my experience of the Navy for the first couple of years I did hush, hush stuff that is exempt from general declassification, so it didn't really train me. You know, you go to get a job and they say, what do you do? And I said I can't tell you or I'll have to kill you. And they don't really like that.

Speaker 1:

That's what my husband says. All the time he was in intelligence in the military, and even now he's like, oh, I worked that and I was like, oh, what was it? Like he goes I'll have to kill you.

Speaker 2:

And I was like, come on, seriously, yeah yeah, and then I wanted to stay in that, but they sent me to Newport, rhode Island, 15 minutes from where I grew up in New Bedford, right, to teach math at the Naval Academy Prep School and you know, boom, blow your mind Right. That's why I joined Right. No, no, that's not why I joined Right. So, yes and no, I mean the thing that the I never will regret having gone in because I grew up so quickly. In fact, when I came back and I saw friends I had left behind, they were years behind where where I was Um it. It really did teach me um a lot about how to carry myself, how to take care of things, um, how to, how to lead people, uh. So I'll never regret um going in.

Speaker 1:

I was proud of my service, um were there a lot of women at that point, I mean because you know how you go into anything, you know, and you look for people like you. You look for oh, there's another female over there, you know, was that? I mean, was that rare to find another woman or another woman, or were you more? Was it so male dominated that you just had to hold your own?

Speaker 2:

Or was it so male dominated that you just had to hold your own? It was very male dominated. I think there was a very, very small percentage of the military at that time that were women in the military. When I trained overseas, I was training actually with a woman and there were three or four males that trained before us and, uh, they were given an oral board at the end to pass, and all four passed it within a half hour. Uh, this woman and I were given our oral board and after four hours they flunked us, um, not because we did anything wrong, but because one of us giggled Because it was so ridiculous.

Speaker 2:

After four hours, I mean, really, come off it right. Oh, my, and you know I was really depressed afterwards and they were going to retest us in another week, which obviously showed we weren't deficient in knowledge. And this British military guy, simon, came up to me and he said Beth, we've never had this conversation, do you understand? I said yes, I do, simon. He said you, as a female, will have to outperform any male by at least three or four times, he said. And so you're going to go into that next board and you're going to pretend you have a shot rock in your shoe and it hurts like hell and there's no way you're going to smile, there's no way that you're going to giggle. You're going to be very serious, and I was.

Speaker 2:

I mean, we went through another four hours and you know, you've got all these guys mothering women with fans going. It's like really come off it. Um but um, we passed, and Simon's words really stuck with me is the fact that, yeah, you really had to show your stuff, that that woman weren't respected at all in at least where I was, and it was one time we had these guys that used to sit and watch the day shift come in because I had the night shift and they would sit and they go. Oh well, she got some last night Whenever they saw a female walk in, and so finally I took a chair and I plopped it back right next to them and I sat there with them drinking my coffee and I went Ooh, I think he got some last night. Well, I love that. That broke them up. They never, they never did it again, at least while I was there.

Speaker 1:

I just think it's a shame that you know, because even when I was in the military, there were women who they had to be very stern, very, almost I will say, male like, but they had to have this I'm a woman, but you can't break me type of you know what I mean Demeanor. And I think it's so sad that we because I feel like we can still be women but still lead- yeah, it took me years to break that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, because you did. You had to be tough as nails, except I wasn't with my, my, my people, right, you know, I, I treated them with respect. I treated, you know, and I actually had one guy that he was enlisted and he wouldn't salute any officer. It didn't matter male or female.

Speaker 1:

Oh, I didn't know, that was a choice. I'm sorry, oh yeah.

Speaker 2:

He would drop his books or whatever he was holding and be scrambling. He had avoidance techniques, you know, down like like anything, right. So so I one day went and I knelt down beside him and I said you know, I've observed you and I see that you're avoiding saluting officers. I just want to know why. I'm not going to write you up or anything. He said I've never met one that I could respect and the day I left that base he stood there and he saluted me.

Speaker 1:

Oh, wow, which is just like, yeah, better than any metal on your chest, right, it makes you feel good. I think what's interesting is that even when I came in so I came in active duty March of 1980. So I came in under the delayed enlistment- as a single parent and apparently the air force had stopped it.

Speaker 1:

I believe in January of 1980 of you can still get in as a single parent, but you have to have all the all the things right. You have to have all the power of attorneys and all this other thing. And so I'm in basic training and it's like, do you have any dependents? I'm like yes, blah, blah, blah. And so my training instructor calls me in and he goes how did you go in as a single parent? I go I don't know Y'all let me in. I did the paperwork in November.

Speaker 1:

He goes, oh, okay, and I believe I was one of the last single parents to get in the military at that point. But the other thing is that even going on active duty, single parents had this. The concept of single parenthood was oh, I'm never going to be there, my child's always sick, I can't do my job, I can't, you know all these things. So they had this certain expectation. So I had to not only be in a male dominated career field, as maybe one most of the time there were two, but sometimes a lot of times there was only me on top of the fact of dealing with this stereotype of single parents are lazy, single parents can't do their job, et cetera. So I had to prove, above and beyond, that I could do the job, so that when my child really was sick, they were like okay, let her go, she's cool, you know she's got everything done. Goes, she's cool, you know she's she'll get, she's got everything done.

Speaker 1:

So I I find it that there are still these stereotypes that people have across the board, across all services, about women in general, you know, single parents, whatever it is. And we came out on the other side, beth, I'm just going to say you know, we did pretty good, because we're here to talk about it. How tough are we Right? I'll tell you, yeah, I'm just putting it out there. So you do. You did four years in the Navy, correct? I did five, actually.

Speaker 2:

Five years. Okay, Because there was a some Iranian dust up or something at towards the end.

Speaker 1:

So they stopped all people getting out of the military.

Speaker 2:

They stopped all people getting out of the military, people getting out of the military.

Speaker 1:

I'm like no, please, I'm ready to go um, but so you get out of the service and transition used to be this dirty word that people only whispered in certain circles. Okay, no one ever talked about it in active duty. Every now and then some guy who had retired or gotten out, he'd come back in the squadron. You know, with this, you know civilian, attire on and I'm going why is he here? I don't understand. You're out, you can do whatever you want and you're here. I get it now Because there's this camaraderie. And after you get out you're straddling two worlds. You're not quite in the military world anymore, but you're not quite in the civilian world anymore. How was your transition getting out? Were you prepared for it? Were you unprepared? Was it horrific? Can you explain to our audience what it was like for you, especially at that time, in the late 70s, early 80s, in the late 70s, early 80s?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I thought first of all I'd prepare for my transition by going back for my master's in mathematics at Bridgewater State College and that sort of fell apart. When I showed up one day in uniform because I was in a rush and I couldn't change, and they jeered me, they spit at me, they threw food at me Don't walk through the cafeteria during that time frame in uniform. So and you know, called me a baby killer and I was just appalled at this attitude and I had been so used to just being in the military with military people around me. You have that complete support system. They are family, right? Um, you know, if you're a little short before payday, someone's going to help you out.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, um, so on the same boat. You know, no one had money three days before payday. We were all in the same boat, you know, no one had money three days before payday.

Speaker 2:

That's right.

Speaker 1:

That's right, yeah, so you know bum cigarettes off of somebody.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, but, and also shortly before I left, I knew I was going to be in a little bit of trouble mentally, because I went with a friend to a concert and we were in civilian clothes and we went to this concert and we just sat there looking at the people going into the concert because it was fascinating. They all had different clothes on right, they had different length, hair right, different sizes.

Speaker 2:

You know, I was was like, oh my, this is this is different, I know and and um, and then you know, one day you're in and uh, you know, before I got out, um, they, um, this friend of mine said I've got to brief you on this before you lose your security system, because it's so cool. And I'm like OK. So he tells me all this stuff and he says, ok, now I have to to take your clearance, right. And I was like OK. And so one day I was here and the next day I'm like out, right. And oh, my goodness, it's like what do you do? So my teeth were having problems. When I was in the military they had a lot of new dentists who were playing with dentistry, right, and so they always had me in the dentist chair and one one dentist drilled into the side of my mouth and said, oops, I had never heard that one before said, oops, I had never heard that one before, and at the end he said don't eat for three days.

Speaker 2:

So you know, my teeth were pretty much a mess when I got out. So one guy said go to the VA. Oh, the VA, that's a resource. Great. I spent two days wandering around the VA campus trying to find someone who would help me, you know, with the tooth problem, and I got sitting in the brown chair, sitting in the orange chair, sitting in this. I'm very obedient, you know. Okay, by now I'll sit in the brown chair. What color chairs you want me in? I'm there, right, just tell me where to go. Tell me where to go. And and you know, it's just I I never got, you know, cause somebody said you can get a dental chip. Well, there's no such thing as a dental chip, apparently, or at least I never got one. So I was like that was like well, va care, I don't know how to use it, I guess, or whatever, it's hopeless, it didn't help me. So I was just out as a civilian, with you know, you don't have a parachute, right, you're just out there, you're free falling.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, hoping you land somewhere soft.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah. And so I, you know, I got a job. But I, you know, I decided well, I'll go into high tech. Well, first I tried teaching and that wasn't what I wanted to do. And then I decided to go into high tech and Raytheon kicked me out of the job fair, saying I wasn't even qualified to be in that job fair. So I was like, okay, well, I thought you were friendly to the service, I guess not, right? Oh, yeah, yeah, that still happens, by the way, oh my God. And so I finally got hired as a computer room supervisor at a place that used to make programmable controllers for industry, by a very short man who was insecure and would hire a woman.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's really interesting because a lot of people feel kind of trepidation about getting out of the military. I was ready After 20 years. I was like I'm done, let's go Got my little DD-214. I'm prancing out the door, I'm expecting. I always tell people I wanted balloons and music and bands and and and organizations say here, here's a contract. Throwing contracts at me Cause who didn't, who wouldn't want a communications project manager with 20 years of experience? Yeah, Sounds great Right.

Speaker 2:

Nobody wanted.

Speaker 1:

I couldn't. I couldn't get a. How are you? What I got a lot was nothing, or you're overqualified. I got that a lot. And then you go into the free fall and you're just kind of like, what is this? Hot crap, you know. And I'd always kept one foot in the fitness industry because I needed extra money, because everyone knows we make so much money in the military. And I thought, you know, I went to my husband and I said I think I really want to see if this fitness thing will work out, and he was like, okay, let's do it. And I've been doing it ever since.

Speaker 1:

But I want to kind of segue into feeling invisible, because this is something that women, even today getting out of the military, still feel. And you see it on TV. Like whenever there's a veteran's holiday, I am looking at the TV hard because I want to see female faces. I want to hear a female voice. You know what I see. I see men hear a female voice. You know what I see. I see men. I love my veteran brothers. I do, but I serve too and it's so maddening to me. We have a supermarket here that has veteran parking and if I tell you that I have been confronted by people who have not served by the way. Have been confronted by people, not who have not served by the way, telling me I shouldn't be parking there.

Speaker 2:

Why am I parking there with?

Speaker 1:

my husband's car? Yes, and you know how, when you're right about something, you have this sense of like. I don't want to say superiority, but you know you're right, you know what I mean, yep, and so you know people said, oh, I'm going to call the cops. I'm like, okay, when they get here, just tell them I'm in the supermarket shopping, good for you. I don't even, I don't even play into it, because at first it makes you angry, it makes you very angry, and then you're kind of like wait, I don't have anything to prove because you know what? Even on my license plate it says North Carolina Air Force veteran retired. So you know, I wanted to see if the cops ever showed up, because I don't know if they did. I want to see the look on the person's face when he goes. You didn't look at the license plate, did you? But there's also this feeling of we're not seen.

Speaker 2:

How did that feel for you? After you got out, you know, and after showing up at the campus and finding I was so hated, I just hid it. I was like, okay, fine, I'm not going to. You know, it didn't help me at all with getting a job right. So for years I just put it, I stamped it down and I would look at things like the, you know, oh yay, veterans lunch for Veterans Day, type of thing, and there'd be all these guys that would be going.

Speaker 1:

Yes.

Speaker 2:

And you know, none of the guys you know seem to treat or even recognize the female veterans, and you know that was hard, the female veterans, and you know that was hard. No one, no one, until my most recent running group, who I adore, you know, no one really thought anything of it. Okay, that was a weird thing that that Beth did. So I, I felt, you know, I felt almost guilty, which is, you know, wrong, but you know it. It it was like I definitely felt less than that. I didn't feel that I could claim the title of veteran, even after, you know, five years of being well, it was only five years. Yeah, okay, just take that five years and put it off.

Speaker 2:

And and uh, so it really wasn't until you know, maybe about six years ago now, that I was walking into my, my local hardware store and this guy who looked like he was probably a hippie in the Vietnam War, who protested against it, you know that era, right, yeah, yeah, he came walking up to me immediately. I, I tensed, you know, uh-oh, what's this guy want? And he, he looked at me, he said thank you for your service. And you know, I, I had heard that so much from you know, people, telling people because you know we were starting to embrace the military, and and and I thought, oh, you know, mean it, come on, mean it. And I knew this guy meant it. Yeah, um that.

Speaker 1:

And it's not just this kind of oh thank you for service. You know, thank you for service.

Speaker 2:

Thank you for service. No, he sincerely, and I started crying. I just started crying, yeah, and I, I, and and all I could think of was how did you know? And a friend of mine had persuaded me to get veteran plates for my car and I said that's your car, right? And I said yeah. He said you're a veteran, right? I said, yeah, still, like you're like my you know me, you know who I am.

Speaker 2:

My brain is just trying to, you know, absorb this. Yeah, so now I park proudly in veteran parking spots. I did before that. I was like yeah. I'm not going to use that my husband's like that.

Speaker 1:

He goes. Oh, I don't want to park there, I go, honey. It doesn't say disabled veteran, it doesn't, you know? I mean, it says veteran, I park there every time it's open and when someone's parked there I have the audacity to get mad.

Speaker 1:

Well, I will say that, you know, when I got out in 2000, I was actually told by the transition team I was not eligible to go to VA at all because I was getting TRICARE, because I was retiree. I never went. I just recently signed up to be a part of the VA. Just recently, and you know it's, we come out and if, if we're not near an air force base or any base, you feel like you're. The isolation I feel like is even more because you're around all of these civilians. No, you know, we're not, you know we don't just go. Hey, I'm a veteran. Hi, you know, we kind of keep it under wraps.

Speaker 1:

And I remember we were in Boston when 9-11 happened and we were, my husband and I, were going to a supermarket and everyone had these little flags on their car to show their support, right. And so I'm getting ready to walk into the supermarket and the guy says would you like to buy a flag? And I said no, thank you. And he goes what have you done for your country? And I whipped around and said I did 20 years for my country and I walked in the store, right, and my husband was with me he goes. What did that guy say to you? And I? I told him I said do you think we need to have a flag? He goes we don't have anything to prove, we've proven it by wearing the uniform, yeah. And I was like, oh yeah, but it still felt bad. You know what I mean. You still feel this sense of invisibility, but you don't know how to come out of it. And I think that when we are seen on TV, more we're seen in print, more we're seen in other places billboards I don't even know if they do billboards anymore, but seeing more female veterans, I think, is going to help that. But I'm with you.

Speaker 1:

When we first moved to North Carolina, I went to a veteran networking event and there were probably three other women there and so you got all the guys over here and three women over here chatting it up together and I thought this sucks. It really sucks. I think everything is. I think it's better now, I feel. As far as for P, for women getting out, um, but I think it's. It's either feast or famine. When I got out, there was LinkedIn and a resume and now it's like ordering. Have you if you've ever gone to the supermarket and looked in the bread aisle and you just go. Now it's like ordering. If you've ever gone to the supermarket and looked in the bread aisle and you just go. I don't know what kind of bread I want, I don't know what I need to choose from, you just got to go. Ah, that one looks good. I think staying connected is very huge now, which is what you and I didn't have coming out, because there was nothing to connect to. There may have been, I didn't know, and you probably didn't know.

Speaker 2:

I know because they didn't tell us. Yeah, and, as you say, when you're not living in a, in a community like Norfolk, virginia or someplace where there's a large amount of veterans who have gotten out there, um, you know, people don't really understand and you know it's a road race that I love to run. I've run it now for, I think, the past five years and it raises money for veterans, which is fantastic, and at the beginning has anyone who is in the service or a veteran to remain standing, who was, who is in the service or a veteran to remain standing and everyone else to sit down or kneel, um, and it's just. I mean, that's so emotional and and to look around, the first three years I was the only female, um, and now there's there's one other female last year and and this year, but there's also only about five other guys that do this race, so we're clearly in the minority there overall, and then you know there's not, but you guys are.

Speaker 1:

you guys are the trailblazers for others.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, seriously.

Speaker 1:

We have to start somewhere. I wanted to piggyback on what you said. When people say thank you for your service, which I think is you know, if you have time, that's okay to say. But I even say this to other veterans. I say to other veterans thank you for wearing the uniform. Because, when someone civilian says that to me, that tells me that they understand the sacrifice. Thank you for your service.

Speaker 2:

It's kind of like okay, thank you for bringing me my plate of food.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, but I think you know, when you say thank you for wearing the uniform, it just means a lot.

Speaker 2:

It really does.

Speaker 1:

And I've even had civilians say well, what do you say to someone who's a veteran? I'm a person. What do you say to someone who just moved next door to you oh, where'd you move from? You know, what do you do? Blah, blah, you know. You just ask them. Ask a veteran about where they were stationed, ask them about their service. What branch did they serve? Did they like it? You know we love to talk about our service. We're not just gonna blow all over you about it, yeah, but um, I think people just have this whole perception of I don't know like we have this glass wall in front of us or something like they're like I don't know what to say and I'm just like, okay, I get to that late parent too, if someone has had a death in the family.

Speaker 2:

you don't know you sort of, or you know a serious illness. You don't know you sort of, or you know a serious illness you don't know what to say, right? Well, yeah, they treat us almost the same way of we don't know how to deal with this. Um, you know, deal with us with curiosity, as you would with any other human, absolutely.

Speaker 1:

I find that kids are more apt to ask great questions yeah, than adults great that way yeah, let's move on to your book, your series. Did this whole military active duty, veteran invisibility, all of that have something to do with your series of books coming out?

Speaker 2:

something to do with your, your series of books coming out. Well, you know, I think, in a, in a way it did. Um, you know, my, my books encompass so much of me, um, it's, it's fantastic. But they do embrace, um, you know, the, the military part and and bring bits and pieces um forward in in different ways. So it it, you know, and I I probably say I'm a veteran in the little bio that that's on the book. So, you know, is it fiction or nonfiction? They're all fiction.

Speaker 2:

You know, whenever we write fiction, though, we, we, you, you know, sort of things seep in right, um so, but, um, yeah, I, I had always wanted to write their russian spy novels and I had always wanted to write a russian spy novel. And, um, I was coming again, transitions, right, I was uh coming towards, uh, the end of my work in high tech and starting to look at a transition out there, and then the pandemic came and I couldn't travel anymore, and so it was like, oh well, time to use that spare time to write the great American novel. And then novel one finished, but novel two was there, and novel two finished, but novel three was there.

Speaker 1:

And they were just like oh wow, they're multiplying, yeah.

Speaker 2:

These characters wouldn't let go. You know it was like, OK, fine, let's just keep on, keep on rolling. So I love that.

Speaker 1:

Do you have any advice for women getting out of the military today? And the one thing that I like to tell women all the time is one stay connected prior to you getting out. And number two, I always ask women veterans if you could not use the word veteran, military service or active duty describe who you are to me duty.

Speaker 2:

Who describe who you are? To me, yeah, I think that's the hardest thing to struggle with, right, because we're so identified with. We're wearing that uniform proudly, exactly, and that's why I asked that question. Yes, and so who are you under the uniform? Right, and I think we miss all of those wonderful skills that we've acquired. But how do you describe them when everyone else around you understands it and gets it? When you're in the military, well, how would you describe it to someone from another planet?

Speaker 1:

Because really that's what you're doing.

Speaker 2:

You're coming in.

Speaker 1:

It's almost like an alternate universe, right. It's like the people look the same, they're speaking English, but they don't understand why you did what you did, why you wore the uniform, why it's so hard. You all, you, you know you were cause you think, oh, I was a civilian before I can civilian again. You know it shouldn't be that hard, but you've, you've become such a different person. And so when you go back and I've asked this question of, especially of women who come from small towns and they think that that small town is their whole universe and they go in the military, and I said, do you feel as though you outgrew the town and or the people, or maybe even your friends, because of your experience in the military?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and and I really felt that, and you know, I think the one thing to embrace is it's OK, right, yes, it's OK to have outgrown where you were, because your experiences were broadened you in so many ways and and deepened you. You know, in the military you learn a different language, right, you learn a whole different culture and when you come out, you're no longer the same person. And I think people who try to just go be that same person again, you can't, because there's no way.

Speaker 2:

Right, you can't, you're not, but to know that's okay.

Speaker 1:

Yes, A couple more questions before we end. You know being visible is, you know, women veterans are more out there now, especially with social media, the help of you know being, you know, on social media, women veterans and veterans in general starting their own businesses. So there's been more of a contribution, um, from women who have been in the military, and so there's this shift. And how do you feel about this shift about women being? I kind of know your answer, but how do you feel about it? How do you feel about us coming out, so to speak?

Speaker 2:

You know it's, it's wonderful. You know I even just me being on your show, I got to tell you this feels so good inside to speak to another female veteran. Oh, it really does. My military buddy, you know that I've kept in touch with is is way out on the West coast and we don't speak that often, but when we do there is such a connection and you know to to be heard and recognized.

Speaker 1:

Absolutely. It feels so good when someone recognizes your service, doesn't it? It's just, it just feels. One more story I'm in the same supermarket, in the same parking lot, and there's a woman parked next to me and I had my window down. I was looking at my phone and she yells across, she goes, thank you for your service. And it was another female. I was like, oh my God, I was so excited that they noticed, you know because it doesn't happen a lot.

Speaker 1:

If it happened, all the time you'd be like, yeah, whatever I mean. Okay, I would probably say whatever, but you know it's, it's so, it just feels so good. So, um future projects, beth, what's coming up for you? More books, a movie, netflix what are we doing?

Speaker 2:

I do think my books would make a great movie, so if anyone knows how to get connected there, I'd love that. But book number four is at the editors right now, so hopefully that will be coming out later this year. I also come from a family of artists, um, and I do oil painting, and so I have a solo show coming up in uh september that I'm almost ready for multifaceted man, I love it and then you know I'm I still run around starting, uh, this week I train my running group uh with personal training.

Speaker 2:

I do, uh I've done, a lot of stuff. I like to do stuff pro bono for women and my running group is a whole group of women and, and you know, it's like I'm not a certified personal trainer. Why shouldn't I, you know, give an hour a week to you guys?

Speaker 1:

And.

Speaker 2:

I'm a videographer. I'm not active in that right now, but I used to do little videos for females websites when they were starting their business. Um, because a lot of times they didn't have the money to go get a videographer to to to have, and you know you have to have video on your website. So I would, I would do that for free for them. Um, so you know, I don't know what else is is going to come.

Speaker 1:

This is a great day. I'm just going to say you're kind of busy. I'm like Beth. Can you do one more thing, beth? Where can people find your books?

Speaker 2:

Oh yes, they're. They're actually for those who like Amazon, they're on Amazon. They're actually for those who like Amazon, they're on Amazon. You can look for Moscow Knights Return or you can do Beth H the H is important, the middle initial, h Macy, because there is another really good writer from down south, beth Macy.

Speaker 1:

I think she's from.

Speaker 2:

Roanoke, Virginia. All the Macy's are related so she's probably a long-distance cousin or whatever. She's probably a long-distance relative.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, Virginia, All the Macy's are related, so she's probably a long distance relative.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so they're on Amazon, they're on Walmart online, they're on Apple, they're on this place called Ingram Sparks, if you want hard copies, so you can usually find them. Barnes Nobles, you can usually find them somewhere. Just to Google either Beth H, macy, moscow, knights, return, it will get you there.

Speaker 1:

Beth, what's the best way for people to reach out to you if they want you for future projects? Maybe other podcasts?

Speaker 2:

et cetera. Yeah, there's two ways. One, I have bethmacycom as a website and there's a link there to to email me. That also links off to all the rest of my websites the personal training one, they are, this one, you know, the books All her, all her websites. Yeah, all my websites. They can also, if they want to, to drop me an email at at info at bethmacycom. It will get to me.

Speaker 1:

So yeah, beth, thank you so much for being a guest today For all our listeners. I hope you listened, and Beth does a lot of things, but the one thing I want you to understand is that we have to reinvent who we are after we come out of this service. We get to be anybody, not just sergeant, lieutenant, captain, colonel, whatever. We get to be someone else, and that's the fun part is figuring out who you want to be after your military service. And Beth has definitely done that. She's many things. She's you heard her. She's doing all the things Because why not? Life is short. Go out there and do you Do something that scares the crap out of you? You already did one of the hardest things ever Is wearing a uniform. What else can scare you? Just go do it. I keep saying that I don't know what else to say. I can find another person. So until next time, as normal, as usual, not normal. Please stay safe, take care of yourself. Until next time.

Speaker 2:

Remember it's never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never. Thank you.